CARER OR CAREWORKER

I think that you are judging care workers and this is a bit unfair. I don't feel you can judge people by their job titles. I have found good and bad in all areas regardless of the job title they are given or how high up the ladder they are. I continue to deal with people on an individual basis and make my mind up based on performance.

susan i think u miss understood what i was getting at im not judging anyone my job title is a CAREWORKER, yet i dont see myself as just a careworker id say i was a CARER, i simply give a personal oppinion on what i thought the difference was, i didnt judge anyone.

I see no difference ( as I am sure you would expect). It's semantics at its worst. I have been a "care worker" for over 30 years, and worked with many of the best " care workers" around. Oh, and they also happen to care. Amongst them have been some of the best GP's nurses, consultants, physiotherapists, home carers, SALT's and many others. It is standards that count, not titles, ( although titles are necessary in the real world.) Incidently I have been involved in a number of abuse cases wher " carers" have been anything but! So let us end this stream now. dstewart2

I have to totally disagree with what you are saying about Carer and Care Workers to me they are both the same and you cant really say that a Carer works differently to a Care Worker in my opinion you cant compare them as I would say they both do the same job the only difference is there job title so im afraid im going to have to disagree with what you are saying and i think that it is wrong so i say that i have to agree with what Susan has said.

Sounds to me like you have a bit of a personal point that you are trying to make?

Not sure that the forum is necessarily the right place to ask for people's opinions on something that when read feels rather 'loaded'?

it's the principles -respect,dignity and postivie regard given freely and consistently by someone else that makes them a carer, support worker, care worker, care giver etc.

I to have to agree with the others on this, Carer - Care Worker, what's the difference? No difference what so ever. there are some in both catagories that are only in the the care industry fo the money or to hold power over their Service users! You've only got to look at the recent news about that home where ABUSE of people with learning dissabilities was happening and the carer who reported what was happening! the whistle blower to me was there for the residents and the others for the power and also the money.

So it is unfair to lable Carers and Care Workers!

In response to Nicola, when you say you think the statement is "loaded" what do you mean by that? and are you referring to "Old Forum User" or the message above you from "Jane Moss". - I find it interesting that you don't think the forum is the correct place for discussion, perhaps you could be more specific give us some more detail, and tell us why not?
I wasn't aware there was a list of "do not discuss" topics, I thought that's what the forum was for - to discuss topics!
Mac.

Who cares.... It's only what a name. I am sure most people put both carers and care workers in same group,,, Over a number of years I have been an auxillary. An auxillary Nurse. A Carer. A Care assistant. and Now a HCA.. Health Care Assistant. Who cares what your called as long as you carry out your caring to a good standard.. i think in general anyone in the care industry is looked upon as doing a good job )

Michelle

I absolutely agree with you. this is certainly a topic where many people have very different views.

I agree with the person who posted the question.

Unless I misunderstood the point, it was simply that those workers who are MOTIVATED by caring for their patients, in a 'human being way', will tend to think 'would I want to be treated, as I am treating these people ?'.

But workers who simply see 'caring as a job', will tend to somewhat dispassionately 'simply follow the rules' WITHOUT 'putting MYSELF in his shoes'.

But I might have missed the point !

Just thought I would throw my hat in the ring. I have always felt that the job title of 'Care Worker' doesn't show the respect that the position demands; and I have never liked the term.

I prefer to look at it this way:
Carer - A person who engages in caring activities, but who does not hold a recognised qualification.
Health Care Assistant - As above, but with a recognised qualification. I would hold the HCA to a higher standard of working practice, as they should be trained in health conditions and be able to work at a higher level (between Carer and Nurse) than a Carer.

For me, it is important to promote the profession of both Carer and HCA so that other professions recognise the value of both. I think it comes down to how other health professions feel they can work with you, because without a level of professional respect the people we care for won't ge the kind of service they need i.e. joined-up working and continuing care.

This is just my opinion, but I think that it is important to have respect for your profession and I would like to see industry standard titles for the job roles.

Also, Mike Stone pointed out that there are Carers who just do it as a job. I have no problem with people who see caring as a job, the important thing is are they good at the job? To be good at the job you have to have empathy and follow best practice, which means treating people with dignity and respect. I find that shoddy carers are the product of a bad environment and bad training.

P.S. This is my first time posting so be gentle.

Hi Darren, welcome to the forum!

I agree with you to a point up to the last paragraph! i feel a carer who is in the profession just as a job i feel isn't likely to spend that little extra time with their Service users or clients as they tend to cut most of their calls short so they get to their next client on time, plus they are only in it for themselves and the wage at the end of the month.

I myself am often getting told of for spending to much time with my clients, because with some of the service users we are sometimes the only contact they have with anyone

James, I think you are discussing the original poster's point, and so am I, but some other people are not.
I think that just following 'tick-box lists' of what 'managers believe needs to be done' pays no attention to the fact that everyone is a unique individual, with different 'needs to satisfy', and that especially for older people, doing things which 'bring a bit of happiness into their lives' is something which a 'carer' would wish to do.
The discussion about qualifications, is a different issue: I don't think that was what the original poster was getting at.

im new to this ,but with my experience with care companies there is alot to be said for some ov the standards ov care and dignity that service users recieve...i myself give a 110% to each service user and dont care wat the management say im a caring person at the end ov the day.

A title does not come into this argument at all , I could be a cleaner but still be a carer, I could be a manager yet still be a carer ,what matters is how you do your job and if you truly CARE ! HSA, care assistant, support worker if we do what we are supposed to what we are called doesnt matter !!

Rochelle, I fully agree that the 'mindset of caring' is what matters.

The issue of titles and job descriptions is a sort of side issue, and I think this debate was being side-tracked away from the point you made - the issue is do people 'truly care' !

And, is it possible to behave in exactly the same way, if 'I am doing this as a job, efficiently, but WITHOUT 'truly caring'' ?

Mike, I agree. The point of the original post has been completely missed by most of the people commenting

The original post was simply pointing out the difference between a true "carer" and those who "work" in care. Job titles are irrelevant

I am a carer whose life has been literally saved by the intervention of care assistants. Admittedly they are people working to earn a living, but many of them are quite professional in their approach to the job of caring and I for one would be lost without their additional input.

Not all are good, but like in most walks of like there are those who are worth their weight in gold. Most of them are undervalued and grossly underpaid for the work that they do, which is often dirtier than what bin men have to deal with and yet they also have to talk to the people whose excrement they have just cleaned up, like I used to have to deal with. So please don't confuse the odd jobs-worth with the real care workers who do a fabulous and often undervalued job.

Carers and careworkers surely have the same responsiblities but however they differ in the way that carers are the immediate members of family or next of kin of the service user, and careworkers are the professionals employed to do the caring job supporting the service user.
Careworkers are fully trained. competent and skilled to do the job.

i am a senior carer and induct new carers ,i always make a point of telling them,ANYONE CAN BE A CARER NOT EVERYONE CARES. a carer who cares will be a coniencous worker and take pride in the work they do.they anwer buzzers more promptley and they dont leave people in toilets and forget about them .they also engage in coversation with the resident during their meal an not with other carers. they clean up after themselves and the residents .they attend the report in the morning because they care about the resident.they check on resindents in bed regular and give them fluids and make them comfortable they do there outmost if a residents looks very down or depressed by cheering them up an reassuring them when they are worried about things i could go on and on. a careworker does the opposite of all of the above .

theres no money in care work its the compassion that keeps us there we are extreamly under paid

Mary I know carers that I've worked with who don't give residents a wash i the mornings they didn't like it when I confronted then.
------Original Message------
From: Dignity Champions Discussion Forum
To: Jo McCowey
Subject: [Dignity Champions Discussion Forum] - Re: CARER OR CAREWORKER
Sent: 28 Mar 2012 01:25

Message sent by MARY TAYLOR.

i am a senior carer and induct new carers ,i always make a point of telling them,ANYONE CAN BE A CARER NOT EVERYONE CARES. a carer who cares will be a coniencous worker and take pride in the work they do.they anwer buzzers more promptley and they dont leave people in toilets and forget about them .they also engage in coversation with the resident during their meal an not with other carers. they clean up after themselves and the residents .they attend the report in the morning because they care about the resident.they check on resindents in bed regular and give them fluids and make them comfortable they do there outmost if a residents looks very down or depressed by cheering them up an reassuring them when they are worried about things i could go on and on. a careworker does the opposite of all of the above .

If I had to choose a title it wouldn't be carer or care worker - it should be 'support workers'. If we are practicing person centred care then we are supporting our service users and working in partnership with them. This wording defines an approach that promotes all of the values of person centred care; dignity, respect, privacy, partnership, rights, choice, individuality and independence - there is a quote (I'm not sure where it comes from) "don't do it for me, don't do it to me, do it with me" Care sounds far too much like us looking after someone when we should be working with them. Of course we should be caring but above all, I think we should be supportive.

Well done Nicki
Absolutely agree. When the Disability movement became more active in the nineties the terminology moved towards support rather than care worker and also some disabled people preferred the term personal assistant.
However, our terminology has slipped back as workers in "care" homes are often called "Carers" and Carers such as myself as a daughter of two very old parents or indeed a mother of a disabled daughter get a bit upset as they feel that they are the real Carers and the others are workers who are paid.
I think that Crossroads (now combined with the Princes Trust) has written about this terminology.

As formal support workers we must accept what service users (our customers) and their Carers tell us that they want to be called.

Do have a look at the last two verses I added to a dignity poem sent to the network a month or do ago. I sent a blog about the language of Dignity and sadly only two people a thusly commented.

Regards

Lorraine

good for u jo thats the way to do it , they will soon learn when they see u on shift, to wash the poor residentdo they come to work in the morn without a wash they must do if they dont wash the person they r takin care of. bless them.

I think most carers care, its just that because it is low paid,low status work the job is often done by people who do not have the ability to put themselves into the shoes of the person who they are supporting. There is also the strong effect of institutionalization on the staff group. The only places I have worked at where there is real person centred care with dignity have been where it is strongly enforced from the top. The change was very painful, with many longserving staff being suspended for such things as taking people to bed who did not want to go as this had been the previous culture and they could not change.
Where I work the new manager has hardly spoken to the residents and this says it all. I have spoken to all the carers and requested a meeting as we are all agreed that our clients should not be being told when to go to bed ( amongst other undignified things ). I have already had my shifts reduced so much that I am having to look for another job anyway. I am on bank hours and this is how one is treated if one speaks up.

Dear Catharine I was really surprised to hear that people think care workers have the lowest paid job and that the job is just another job. I think people need to be made aware that you now have to be suitably qualified to be a care worker and can undergo different courses to rise up the ranks. Training for care workers is ongoing to enhance their skills and knowledge of the job.In any care setting staff should be encouraged to say any concerns or problems they notice about the people they care for. If correct procedures are followed and nothing is done about it then they can whisltblow. Service user should be treated with respect and dignity observing their human rights.I think the new Manager needs to be made aware that she needs to be seen interacting with her residents. Engelina Mafirakurewa

Medow Care Services Ltd
Unit 25
Fiddlebridge Industrial Centre
Hatfield
Herts
AL10 0DE

Tel; 01707 271512
Mob; 07599213533
Web; www.medowcareservicesltd.co.uk
> From: [log in to view email address]

> To: [log in to view email address]
> Subject: [Dignity Champions Discussion Forum] - Re: CARER OR CAREWORKER
> Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 06:47:46 +0100
>
> Message sent by Catharine Davies.
>
> I think most carers care, its just that because it is low paid,low status work the job is often done by people who do not have the ability to put themselves into the shoes of the person who they are supporting. There is also the strong effect of institutionalization on the staff group. The only places I have worked at where there is real person centred care with dignity have been where it is strongly enforced from the top. The change was very painful, with many longserving staff being suspended for such things as taking people to bed who did not want to go as this had been the previous culture and they could not change.
> Where I work the new manager has hardly spoken to the residents and this says it all. I have spoken to all the carers and requested a meeting as we are all agreed that our clients should not be being told when to go to bed ( amongst other undignified things ). I have already had my shifts reduced so much that I am having to look for another job anyway. I am on bank hours and this is how one is treated if one speaks up.
>
>
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Its the way the employers and managers speak to the care workers rather
than anyone else. Most of our staff are well qualified. I have requested a
meeting with owner and manager so we can all address the issues affecting
the clients as this is what most staff care about more than anything. All
care staff are agreed so it will be interesting to see the reaction.If
nothing changes then we will whilstleblow.then.We had all just had training

why are support workers low paid?

'Most of them are undervalued and grossly underpaid for the work that they do'

Old Forum User, when you posted the above comment, although I am not a care worker, I feel 100% that you are spot on !

There is a similar debate for the ratio of nurses to HCAs, which rages on the Nursing Times 'site from time to time. The nurses moan that they are increasingly being replaced by less-qualified HCAs, whose work nurses need to supervise, and yet that HCAs are doing things which would once have only been done by nurses.

I don't really care what someone's title is, provided they do the task well - as a potential patient, or patient's relative, I just want to be properly and competently treated, with respect and empathy, etc.

The complication, of course, is the conflict between an older population needing more 'care', and a desire to minimise the amount of money spent achieving that care.

I can't honestly that title helps. Having spent many years as a children's social worker I can see that many care workers have not developed certain skills in childhood, which it is hard to learn later in life. The sort of training these people would need would be intensive and involve role play and much challenging of individuals.
Our new home manager is a highly trained nurse, but speaks to the residents as if they are naughty children, tells them to go to bed when they don't want to, touches then without permission,,doesn't explain what she is doing, I keep trying to tactfully educate but do not have the authority. yesterday she told me " they can have choice in the afternoon!" . I am constantly on the verge of whistleblowing, but she would know it was me and I only have bank hours which keep being cut and I know why! The other worst offender is doing NVQ3.
I am giving in one more week then making that call.

Catherine
Make that call now. This nurse is intervening her professional code so you need to report her to the NMC too.

I think you have an axe to grind with someone and if this is the case you should address it with the senior Manager and not judge every other care worker by this persons standards. You sound just a little angry at this person, your message makes a very bold statement its even written in bold. In our organisation everyone is a Support Worker not carer.

I am unable to reply to your email at the moment.

I am concerned as to why we are all worried about 'whistleblowing' ? Our roles are to support and protect vulnerable individuals who pehaps are not able to voice their own concerns. I have blown the 'W' it did not take much, but I feel that if others more frequently stood up for service users and residents it would be less of a challenge. Staff within care are not always as experienced and knowledgable as we would sometime like. As the population ages and demand increases I have found that many providers are willing to employ staff with little or NO experience. I have witnessed inexperienced staff being thrown into situations which require training and understanding, but due to the poor pay within elderly care many providers are employing people who dont have a clue, just to cover demand! I disagree very much with those who say staff are well trained and supported - in the community I can say this is not always true, I want to promote Quality care and stand up for those who are let down by the current syatems - but where do I start??

Rochelle Monte

Staff appear to be concerned about 'whistleblowing' because a fair few of those who do blow the whistle, are then bullied, intimidated and quite possibly sacked - the consequences of raising concerns, still needs to be addressed if staff are to raise issues when they see them.

Currently it takes a fair amount of bravery to raise concerns, and that bravery should not be necessary !

what an interesting debate, which has been rehearsed so many times. two things occur to me, the phrase carer can be applied to so many roles soe of which are paid and some unpaid. it is the way in which the 'job' is done and the expereinec of those receiving the care that differentiates those who approach their tasks with compassion, dignity and humanity; and those who see the role merely a way of pasisng time. secondly it is the way in which those people who are caring are valued, that serves to enable them to work in that way. someone who is continually undervalued may well treat others in ways that do nt evidence that they value the contribution. there will always be people who are there for reasons that are not those that the rest of us would hope. Surely our role is to bring value and respect to those with whom we work be that as colleagues or as recipients. without compassion and dignity and respect for your self it is not possible to treat others with respect.
We should never delay challenging bad practice, be that through personal example, or by speaking out. when it comes to dignity and humanity doing nothing is never an option. there are always methods in which we can whistleblow,although i accept that it is never easy.

Liz Taylor

My 'pet project' is the End-of-Life belief and behaviour set for those patients who are in thier own homes, and who wish to die at home.

Most live-with relatives are in my opinion definitely carers, and will I suspect usually be defending the wishes of the person who is dying - current CPR/VoD protocols seem to treat live-wth relatives as 'interlopers and potential suspects' which is enormously ynhelpful, considering that dying a thome is already horribly complicated !

I agree with yuor observation if that if 'the system' undervalues and badly treats paid carers, some of them might well become less caring and considerate as a consequence !

Nicki Cailes

Nicki, I very much agree with your point about titles - everyone, including doctors, is actually supposed to be 'supporting the patient/client'. Too many different titles, can easily get in the way of proper joined-up patient-centred behaviour.

Everyone is supposed to be helping !